(FIXED) BOARD 10.3 Adaptive Web Page Sizing - How is this Optimised?
Answers
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Hi Bjorn,
Thank you for the capsule and your efforts in this matter. Your images, and my own testing, demonstrate that there is a large pre-defined and fixed modelling area.
My expectation was for the size of the screen area to be dynamically set from the top left of the screen to the last active pixel at the bottom right of the area - Microsoft call this this 'display scaling'. This is not currently something that BOARD 10.3 can achieve.
For completeness, I have illustrated my expectation of the behaviour below. I will now follow up all further discussions on the matter with my local BOARD support team.
Thanks Björn Reuber, you've been instrumental in defining the potential issues with this feature.
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An illustration of my expectation of the Adaptive web page sizing
The principle of what I had expected from the feature by using Microsoft Office 365 WORD.
Image 1: Below is of a 100% page view with MS Office 365 Word and displayed 2560x1440. There are large borders left and right of the page.
Image 2: By setting the scaling to ZOOM to Page width, the MS Office 365 Word document at 2560x1440 resolution now fills screen to width of page:
Image 3: I can move this screen to a laptop with a resolution of 1366x768, changing absolutely none of the settings and the document is again scaled to fill the screen by the width of the page:
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Hi,
about
Paul Wyatt - GVA wrote:
Hi Bjorn,
Thank you for the capsule and your efforts in this matter. Your images, and my own testing, demonstrate that there is a large pre-defined and fixed modelling area.
I wouldn't agree. Cause i defined the label on Windows client to demonstrate which area is used/saved in Win client. And exactly this screen area is also displayed in HTML5 client (nevertheles if objects are displayed on this space or not)
Regards
Björn
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Hi Björn Reuber, hi Paul Wyatt - Avison Young UK,
I have been following your conversation here over the last days and I have downloaded Bjoern's Capsule. The results with that screen is the best one I have seen so far.
Original:
Fit to page:
If this options would always work like that, then I'd be happy with it.
But as soon I save the screen on my computer (Resolution 1920x1080), the fit to page option does not look as good anymore:
There is quite a bit of space at the bottom again, not as bad as I have seen it with other screens, but there is definitely a visible difference to Bjoern's original version.
I have seen that screen resolution was mentioned quite often in regards to this function, but it is hard for me to understand which size my screen should be for this to work. The screen has not changed in the win client after I have saved it, at least not as far as I can see:
I have attached the new version of the capsule, maybe that helps.
Cheers,
Daniel0 -
Hi Daniel Zillmann,
can't find the CPSX you mentioned, maybe something went wrong on uploading the file.
<kidding> if it's working with CPSX saved by me, I've got a new business idea</kidding>
regards
Björn
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How weird, I can see the uploaded file attached to my comment. Anyway, I uploaded it again with this comment. I hope this one worked. You do seem to have magic BOARD skills.
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Daniel Zillmann wrote:
You do seem to have magic BOARD skills.
I know,.....
about your CPSX, it's using a screen resolution of ScreenResolution="1920,1080" (my cpsx is using ScreenResolution="1600,900"), while nearly all objects got the same size.
So a label (LOG MANAGEMENT AND ANALYSIS) with Width="470" Height="30" is using 470/1920 =24% in your case and 470/1600=29% in mine
So as said before the ratio of element/screen is different, so board tries to use the same width and having a different ratio (so the object are getting smaller in your example)
If you extend the label with the border to the whole screen (as in my example, cause in your example its using the whole heigth, but not the whole width) you can see, that fit to width are working exactly as defined.
regards
Björn
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Thanks Björn Reuber, I read that explanation before but I needed to hear it a second time to get it. Now I also understand why I am struggling so much to get this right and it might be the same for Paul Wyatt - Avison Young UK. I am used to developing screens that fit perfectly on a screen without any scroll bars. But for the "Fit to Page" function to work, I will need to develop the screen in my full resolution (1920x1080) which I normally not do, because I am saving space for the URL bar, BOARD menu bar at the top and whatever else might take up space on the screen. When I now look at the empty space, it is roughly the size of the URL and menu bar.
Thanks for your help, I will keep playing around this.
Cheers,
Daniel2 -
Hi,
please keep in mind that the "usable" screen area may be different from Browser to browser (did some test on this in the past) and could also be "user individual" [just remembering the IE with 5-8 certain toolbars)
regards
Björn
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Hi Paul Wyatt - Avison Young UK
Thank you once again for your detailed analysis. We have been waiting for this feature since we started with Board 2 years ago, and it seems from your experience that it is not yet fully ready (at least from our expectations which seem to be similar to yours).
I understand from the discussion with Björn Reuber that the design of capsule is still very much constrained by the philosophy of the windows client. So I don't know if we can have some real progress with 10.3, but I'm just writing to insist that the current system is a nightmare for developing screens. Either you lock everything and you need to keep things small (and then it looks bad on a big screen), or you don't lock everything and every edition of the capsule might break everything...
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You could write in a small label in your mask "please edit Capsule only if you have screen resolution of xxx X yyyy pixels" so the developers know when they should not edit anything...
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YOU'VE NAILED IT . As the new screen 'feature' cannot behave in any other manner than it does presently, prompts could at least inform developers and users...
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Another way to see it would be to let the developer set manually the reference screen resolution rather than inherit the current one.
I work regularly with two different sizes (laptop+big screen through my docking station) and this is really painful...
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Hi Etienne.
I explained this issue to BOARD UK on Thursday in a meeting to discuss this and other issues with 10.3. They agreed to raise the point of display sizing with BOARD Intl and I am hopeful that a resolution will be implemented by, or in, the 10.5 release.
I was also able to discuss:
1. URL as a value not recognised as a URL.
2. Persistent top border line in a dataview object with all formatting removed.
3. Various other points.
I’ll let you all know if I get any feedback.
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my answer was ironic, glad that you chose it as the correct answer
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Thanks for clarifying. I would hate to have found out you were being serious.
BTW, Our conversation on this 'feature' has now been discussed with BOARD Intl Development with a view to possibly changing the behaviour to something that might be useful. So, let's wait and see what v10.5 brings
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Hi Paul Wyatt - Avison Young UK
We just installed 10.3 with latest patch on our dev server, and now I share your pain...
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Paul Wyatt - GVA wrote:
My thoughts exactly...
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Hi,
but then i would guees, that the screens have been saved with a different/wrong resolution in Win Client
Regards
Björn
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Hi Björn,
I follow your point but that's exactly the issue with the way this is working currently: there should be no "wrong" resolution. The web display should not depend upon any resolution settings in the development environment, especially a setting that the developer cannot change properly.
I understand that the need to maintain both client is complicated, but this current "hybrid" mode in 10.3 looks totally useless from our point of view.
I also tested with capsules that do not use the lock size option but so far I totally agree with Paul Wyatt - Avison Young UK conclusions.
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UPDATE - IT NOW WORKS IN BOARD 10.5
I wanted to add an update to this emotive subject. Screen sizing in BOARD 10.5 web WORKS!!!!
It really works and its great. I haven't tried on ios devices yet but dragging from laptop to 27" UHD and back works fine. The capsule design area behaviour takes a little getting used to when jumping but I'll adapt. More importantly, I no longer have to use a self-imposed fixed canvas optimized for 15" SVGA laptops usionig BOARD WEB...oh the new possibilities make me all dizzy .
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I didn't follow this conversation from the start, but I can see the outcomes in 10.5 which are great.
Thanks to Paul and the rest of the community to highlight the issues and push the BOARD R&D to get the "Adaptive Web Page Sizing" to work as it should!2 -
This is now a non-issue as dynamic web screen sizing is usable. It does highlight a few points though. The first is that we all interpret behaviour in different ways which leads to varying expectations and a breakdown in common understanding; I, for one, did not understand how to use the sizing tools and screen development together. The second point is that new features should really be demonstrated by the developer and not left to interpretation by the user.
I now understand that the BOARD developer can set their 'canvas' size and that the sizing tools act in this pre-determined sizing. Also, I now fully understand how using a mask as the controlling factor, it is possible to create uniform capsule screens and change their size globally if required.
The screen sizing feature is a very power one and allows for models to be displayed on various devices with greatly varying pixel resolutions.
Well done BOARD Lab, you have allowed me to develop and effectively demonstrate to existing and future clients that they can be sitting on a tropical beach, ipad in hand, reviewing their property portfolios - it's a winner, seriously.
Regards,
Paul Wyatt
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